You have 30 seconds to onboard a user to BTC. Which wallet do you recommend?

1781 sats \ 80 comments \ @Wumbo 23 May bitcoin

In the coming months I will be interacting with many average people (no bitcoin wallet) and I would like to fine tune my on boarding process. Think weddings, trade show, elevator ride in a hotel. I will likely have their attention for a short period of time and would like to pay them back for my share of an Uber Ride, Dinner check, Wedding present, etc.. in BTC instead of fiat.

So the poll question:

What is the quickest and easiest wallet to recommend where the whole process needs to be done in 30 seconds?

My Thoughts:

Because of the short time I will have their attention onchain BTC is likely off the table. My first choice (at the moment) is Mutiny because:

I don't have to worry about what device they have (apple, android, linux, etc..). Does their app store allow it.
I can have them join a federation to avoid minimum channel setup amount.
No account setup needed.

I look forward to hearing if there is a better option for my use case.

Mutiny11.0%

Aqua4.9%

Breez22.0%

Phoenix19.5%

Wallet of Satoshi22.0%

Muun4.9%

Speed0.0%

Strike2.4%

CashApp3.7%

Other - Please post answer in a comment9.8%

82 votes \ poll ended

view all related items

142 sats \ 5 replies \ @Natalia 23 May

Blink, beginner friendly and suitable for different users, from normal users to merchants.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Bell_curve 24 May

No USA

0 sats \ 3 replies \ @Wumbo OP 23 May

Looks like you need to enter a phone number for account setup. https://faq.blink.sv/creating-a-blink-account/how-do-i-create-an-account-with-blink

Is that correct in your experience? If so anyway around it?

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @Natalia 23 May

deleted after being seen

11 sats \ 1 reply \ @teemupleb 24 May

At least a few weeks ago they had an option to set up an account fast without giving phone number or email (to receive with very low limits).

I don’t know if they have removed it because of the increasing regulatory scrutiny for custodial Lightning wallets.

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @Bell_curve 24 May

Mutiny and Aqua

Also alby because it’s easy

270 sats \ 12 replies \ @DarthCoin 24 May

ALWAYS HAVE IN MIND THIS

In regards of Mutiny you are WRONG. Mutiny REQUIRE to run your own server in order to be fully self-custodial. Guys please stop saying that Mutiny is self-custodial when is not. If you do not run your own server, it is not different than WoS.

551 sats \ 8 replies \ @benthecarman 24 May

To reiterate for people, darth coin has no idea what he's talking about here. He always insists that mutiny is not self custodial but is categorically wrong. For mutiny everything runs on your device, all our servers do is provide encrypted cloud storage and serve the actual website.

210 sats \ 7 replies \ @DarthCoin 24 May

with your own words...

51 sats \ 6 replies \ @benthecarman 24 May

that doesn't mean we have custody of the money

110 sats \ 5 replies \ @DarthCoin 24 May

that doesn't mean I don't know what am I talking about. I know very well what is about but you always want to minimize this important aspect to the users.

To reiterate for people, darth coin has no idea what he's talking about here

10 sats \ 4 replies \ @benthecarman 24 May

You point to the websocket proxy as evidence that mutiny isn't self custodial. You clearly don't know what it does if you think that

100 sats \ 3 replies \ @DarthCoin 24 May

Yeah sure, just let me know when the domain mutinywallet.com will be seized or gone puff offline. Let's see then what would you say to all Mutiny users that do not run their own server. It says very clearly with your own words "Don't trust us"

70 sats \ 2 replies \ @benthecarman 24 May

their funds wont be gone which is the distinction between self custody and custody.

view replies

21 sats \ 2 replies \ @Wumbo OP 24 May

Good point Darth.

In the end I also want people to get to the full self-custodial level.

But for step one I want to get them "Off Zero".

110 sats \ 1 reply \ @DarthCoin 24 May

here is a quick guide for "get off zero" https://darth-coin.github.io/beginner/getting-started-stack-sats-en.html Custodial is just fine for poor starters, especially the non-KYC ones (could be used as decoy too).

21 sats \ 0 replies \ @Wumbo OP 24 May

What was I thinking, of course the Dark Lord has already made a guide for this.

Thanks

30 sats \ 0 replies \ @025738dda8 24 May

Bitlifi. Send bitcoin "to a phone number". And it's done. No other setup. The other party should receive an SMS with link to the app. For onboarding, it's super simple.

31 sats \ 0 replies \ @sagars209 24 May

sorry, I would tell the user, BTC Is not for folks in hurry, it is gods gift to human kind, if you only have 30 seconds you better stick to fiat!! There are no shortcuts to success

30 sats \ 4 replies \ @DiedOnTitan 24 May

I happen to like Electrum. Old school, battle tested, FOSS (a requirement), no KYC. But this is not a good choice for a wedding because it requires a laptop/computer (and a USB stick running Tails to do it right). Never been one for quick and easy when it comes to Bitcoin software, personally. Security above all else is what I value.

I use several of the above listed lightning wallets on mobile devices for pocket change transactions.

A novel thing to try at a wedding is something like https://tipcards.io/ which allows you to print QR codes with sats that you can physically hand out to people. I have successfully used these for tips at restaurants. I recommend that on the printed paper, you provide very clear step-by-step instructions on how to move the sats to ones own wallet. I have not been rugged by tipcards.io but I also do not vouch for them. There are other possibly more secure ways to print sats to a QR code, but I have not tested those. Happy orange pilling! 🟠

60 sats \ 3 replies \ @DarthCoin 25 May

Electrum works perfectly fine on mobile, also with LN channels. Indeed is a powerful wallet app, but is not a good start just for onboarding with few sats.

0 sats \ 2 replies \ @DiedOnTitan 25 May

I can't believe I did not know Electrum was on mobile....

not a good start just for onboarding with few sats

Yes. On this we are in alignment.

100 sats \ 1 reply \ @DarthCoin 25 May

I explained all features and aspects of LN wallets here https://darth-coin.github.io/wallets/lightning-wallets-comparison-en.html

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @DiedOnTitan 25 May

Thanks for the reference. You have explained so much. Cheers

32 sats \ 3 replies \ @itsrealfake 24 May

I'm done rushing people towards Bitcoin.. if they don't have more than 30 seconds, I'm not gonna involve myself.

1 sat \ 2 replies \ @southside263 24 May

💯agree.

a 30 second cold bitcoin shill is like Jehovah Witness knocking on my door - GTFOH😆

after evangelising bitcoin for 2 years, I’m more of the “when the student is ready…” vibez.

Wallet of Satoshi or Blink if outside of USA.

Cashapp for USA?

These custodial (accounts) are way faster and easy to setup in 30 secs.

Trying to open a channel for Phoenix or Mutiny (self custodial wallets) will be too slow for a brief taxi/hospitality interaction

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @Wumbo OP 24 May

I have never used Cashapp but I assumed (maybe incorrectly) they would have KYC hoops to jump through, is this the case?

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @itsrealfake 24 May

cash app is kyc'd yes

it's usually where I tell people to go to buy bitcoin most easily

151 sats \ 3 replies \ @cryotosensei 23 May

ZBD wallet actually

It’s as easy as it gets. Plus, it gives the user sats for playing games or doing surveys. You never know, maybe your contacts will gain an interest in stacking sats because they come “free”

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @MarsIronPI 24 May

But SN and Nostr are better for "free sats".

21 sats \ 1 reply \ @Wumbo OP 24 May

Do you need to create an account (email confirmation etc..) for ZBD?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @cryotosensei 24 May

Yes. I used my throwaway Gmail account.

31 sats \ 6 replies \ @didiplaywell 23 May

Muun, it's stupid simple, non-custodial and versatile. It only "lacks" any nostr integration, for now, and I'm not even sure it should.

130 sats \ 0 replies \ @DarthCoin 24 May

Read more about the Muun atrocity here: https://darth-coin.github.io/wallets/lightning-wallets-comparison-en.html#muun

146 sats \ 2 replies \ @Radentor 23 May freebie

Hell naw :

Goofy long string "recovery code"
Lacks portability
Expensive atomic swap (chain fee + routing fee)
Dishonest marketing
Even Onchain part requires 2 signatures to spend

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @Wumbo OP 23 May

Dishonest marketing

What are you referring to here?

80 sats \ 0 replies \ @Radentor 23 May

Just check out https://muun.com and verify it yourself

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @cryotosensei 23 May

I still have 2200 sats stuck inside Muun. It worked fine until one day, it didn’t.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @didiplaywell 23 May

That looks just normal, it clearly states that you don't have enough to pay the fee. Costs have risen, that's why at first you had smaller fees

53 sats \ 0 replies \ @BitcoinAbhi 24 May

According to me wallet of Satoshi is easy for beginners.

155 sats \ 0 replies \ @Coinsreporter 24 May

If you've just started and dealing with smaller amounts WoS is best. If you've been here for a while and learnt about handling wallets Breez and Mutiny can be the one for you.

51 sats \ 0 replies \ @Maximux 24 May

I think Wallet of Satoshi (WoS) is the simplest for someone who is starting to learn about Bitcoin (BTC)⚡️

20 sats \ 0 replies \ @freebookspls 24 May

Wallet of satoshi for sure. And would send them their first sats in that 30 seconds

20 sats \ 0 replies \ @ContraMundum 24 May

WOS…easy

20 sats \ 5 replies \ @grayruby 23 May

If you have only 30 seconds probably wallet of satoshi and then once they see how awesome and easy it is you can work on getting them into better non custodial wallets later.

It's a double edge sword. If you give them convenience first they might only accept convenience so if you have more time I would tend to argue for maybe phoenix or zeus but with limited time you should just get them something simple and hope you can convince them to learn and convert later.

20 sats \ 4 replies \ @Wumbo OP 23 May

Can you use zeus with out having a personal backend node to connect it to?

100 sats \ 0 replies \ @DarthCoin 25 May

https://darthcoin.substack.com/p/getting-started-zeus-mobile

0 sats \ 2 replies \ @grayruby 23 May

Yes you need to enable LSP and it will open payment channels for you.

50 sats \ 1 reply \ @southside263 24 May

Zeus is the slowest loading time self custodial wallet😭

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @grayruby 24 May

Fair. Definitely can't onboard someone in 30 seconds when it takes 30 second to load. Haha.

310 sats \ 2 replies \ @DarthCoin 24 May

What is the quickest and easiest wallet to recommend where the whole process needs to be done in 30 seconds?

I will answer with another question: With what amount of sats you will start onboarding? 10 sats? 1000 sats? 50k? 100k ? 1M sats ? Because for each one there's a solution. So your poll is not very specific. Onboarding onchain or on LN depends on a lot of factors. Even for LN depends a lot.

opening channels
onchain fees
LN fees
how liquidity works
custodial / self-custodial
keys / accounts security etc

A lot of things that you are skipping in 30 seconds. Is not that easy to onboard just for the sake of onboarding quick.

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @Wumbo OP 24 May

Between 1,000 - 50,000k Sats

I want to show them it can be easier than paypal, cashapp, etc...

I remember the BTC faucets back in the day how that got me off zero. I am hoping this can be a slightly different version for modern times.

I do understand I am skipping a lot of important education topics in this approach but these people only care about what is easiest. (I can sense the Joker Meme coming from you already)

20 sats \ 0 replies \ @DarthCoin 24 May

50k sats is a lot of money. I would not play around with total noobs with that amount. Later you will always regret it because you gift them 50k sats (or worse if they bought them from you) and after a while they just forgot / lost the access or they don't even remember.

I will always say: be careful who you will onboard. BITCOIN IS NOT FOR EVERYBODY! Bitcoin is not for the weak, only for brave. Fuck the idiots, shitcoiners, fiat maxis etc. Onboard only selective people.

With small amounts, just to play around, any custodial can do it perfectly fine. If they lose it, no big deal. KEEP IT SIMPLE and let them come back later to you asking more questions. That's why I wrote this guide, for these situations: https://darth-coin.github.io/beginner/getting-started-stack-sats-en.html and more here: https://darth-coin.github.io/beginner/beginner.html

@remindme in 1 year

21 sats \ 0 replies \ @Athena 24 May

Mutiny is my choice.

10 sats \ 1 reply \ @beorange 24 May

30s will only allow you to use a custodial solution. Try to get 5 minutes and you will have access to much better alternatives.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Wumbo OP 24 May

Agreed, If I can talk with them longer it is preferred. I have more time to help educate them and pick a better setup.

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @Carresan 24 May

Easiest I have found for a beginner is wallet of Satoshi

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @Sirkay 24 May

I will settle for mutiny or WoS for second option

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @flat24 24 May

I personally recommend Fénix, I am also a beginner in bitcoin for just over a year and I have just been helping others understand. The truth is based on my own experiences, nothing that is a custodian is good, for a long time I used the Muun wallet to make purchases and Stack SAT games until the high fees left me with some funds trapped that I was later able to recover (muun is shit ) on the other hand, I have used ZBD on some occasions and I don't like it since it requires Google spy to work, I tried Coinos and I have used it on a couple of occasions as well as the LN.tipbot, Blixt is a machine but I recently suffered a forced closure of my channel and that led me to lose 30,000 SATS so it is not for newbies. I tried Blue Wallet with Alby and with the Telegram bot and it is wonderful but I don't think it is for very newbies, I also think that it is wrong to use tools that are too easy and for those who are asleep like WoS which is custodian and encourage others to use it. It is better that people, if they are willing to start in bitcoin, begin to know what a commission is, a chain or lightning transfer and a channel with incoming and outgoing liquidity. In my opinion, the easiest to do that and to restore is Phoenix and all without losing custody (which is great for newcomers to learn to protect their first 12-word password)... I forgot to mention that I tried Green Wallet and It also worked well but you must manage your channel (maybe not suitable for newbies)... on my waiting list to try in the next few days is Breez and Electrum. hahaha and I almost forgot SN, nothing is easier than using the SN Wallet. We must recommend that one and so people come directly to SN to learn more about BTC and start their journey down the bitcoin rabbit hole or leave it because they can't stand it so much and run away at once.

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @om 24 May

Fedi Maybe beta but not for long and good enough already Custodial, yes, but so is WoS, and Fedi has the risk more distributed

10 sats \ 1 reply \ @OT 24 May

Maybe a web wallet like coinos.io

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Wumbo OP 24 May

Thanks, I forgot about coinos

Having to create an account is less then optimal in my opinion.

10 sats \ 1 reply \ @cristaiji 23 May

I had an issue withdrawing my sats from the federation on Mutiny. Still have no idea why.

My choice would probably be Blink or WoS with an explanation that they should look at other options for larger amounts and self custody.

10 sats \ 0 replies \ @Wumbo OP 23 May

I forgot about blink. I will need go refresh my memory on its features. Thanks

10 sats \ 1 reply \ @Radentor 23 May

Mutiny : 5 positives vs 2 negative

+	-
Fedi onboarding	12 random words?
self-custody LN	what's fedi and LN ? I thought this was about bitcoin?
Platformless
Fedi address
Contact

WoS : 5 positives

+	-
No channel management	Custodial (bank account custodial anyway)
LN address
Email backup
Simple
Built-in onramp

What is the quickest and easiest wallet to recommend where the whole process needs to be done in 30 seconds?

Optimistic : Mutiny (easy self-cusyody) Realistic : WoS (onramp & simplicity) Other : Minibits ?

291 sats \ 0 replies \ @DarthCoin 24 May

Mutiny (easy self-cusyody)

Mutiny is NOT self-custody if you do not run your own server... it is not different than WoS

10 sats \ 1 reply \ @Signal312 23 May

Could you clarify - which country are we talking about here?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Wumbo OP 23 May

These people will be from many different countries.

USA will be one of them so that will make WoS and Phoenix not a workable option for those people.

112 sats \ 0 replies \ @tolee 23 May

Some things should not be done in 30 seconds. Just ask my wife's boyfriend.

11 sats \ 0 replies \ @03c43494a9 23 May

Cashapp by far since oftentimes people already have it downloaded. If they don't, idk.

0 sats \ 5 replies \ @Satosora 24 May

If I only had 30 seconds....I would give them a paper wallet and explain to them the two keys.

10 sats \ 4 replies \ @Wumbo OP 24 May

OnChain confirmation time would be a problem with this.

Also this will be relative small payments which could be cost prohibitive.

0 sats \ 3 replies \ @Satosora 24 May

You have 30 seconds to explain it. This is probably the best way. Do you really believe in 30 seconds they are going to try sending btc somewhere? At least on the paper you have something to explain, whereas if you are trying to just explain concepts in the air, its going to get lost in the ether.

20 sats \ 2 replies \ @Wumbo OP 24 May

I think with WoS or maybe Mutiny I can complete the transaction in 30 seconds. They might forget about it 3 minutes later but I am talking about small about of Sats to possibly get them thinking about BTC.

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @Satosora 24 May

Doesnt it take longer than 30 seconds to have them set up an account?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Wumbo OP 24 May

It adds some time to the process.

Also I can see people not wanting to set up let "another" account they have to remember and/or be worried their could be a data leak.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Turdinthepunchbowl 23 May

deleted by author

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @throwable 24 May freebie

breez ftw