I've tried getting below the 100K SN-threshold and burned thousands of sats in the process; How do I circumvent this going on?
Lightning is totally alien to me.
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Lightning is totally alien to me.
Just imagine... he have more than a year on SN and still didn't figure it out or even read the frickin' simple guide I wrote for noobs. And is still keeping his few sats on SN...
What are doing these people all day long? With what they wasting their precious time if not with learning about bitcoin ?
UNBELIEVABLE !
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Ha!
Don't be too hard on him Darth, some things take time.
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How much time it gets to read this amazing guide about liquidity (by Bitcoin Design team) ? 5 min? 10 min ? half an hour at most? In one frikin year he couldn't find that time to read the damn guide that was posted everywhere?
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He's practicing tangible skills and starting a bitcoin business, plus he's trying to meet girls.
Let's be supportive.
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You're keeping a good tab on me, spot on.
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How did you burn thousands of sats trying to reduce your SN wallet? Did you send to fake addresses? I’m confused by that part
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Service fees and on-chain fees.
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I found that the best way to get inbound liquidity from SN is just establish a channel to SN, then buy something on Lightning, like a gift card, using your SN channel as the outgoing channel.
This creates a remote balance on your SN channel which you can then use to withdraw from your SN wallet.
Shouldn't cost thousands in sats, maybe hundreds from the initial channel opening but that should be all.
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But how do I keep the inbound up? With every receive, the inbound goes down.
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Personally I just keep spending if I need more inbound liquidity.
Getting inbound liquidity is a known issue for Lightning. There are even services where you can purchase inbound liquidity, though I'm not sure how it works as I've never used it. I guess you just pay people to open a channel to you.
I figure if I just keep spending I not only help the bitcoin circular economy but I also get the inbound liquidity that I need.
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But if I want to save?
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For me, I use bitcoin to spend on my regular needs, by buying amazon gift cards. So this is money that i'd spend anyway. I then buy more bitcoin with my savings. I try to time it so that I'm spending bitcoin when the fiat/bitcoin price is high, and stacking when the fiat/bitcoin price is low.
What is your pubkey? I will consider opening a channel to you. I don't know how helpful it'll be though since I lack inbound liquidity myself.
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What's ment with "loop" out?
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Man, I think I'll stay on-chain.
But how do I keep the inbound up? With every receive, the inbound goes down.
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121 sats \ 4 replies \ @fm 16 Sep
Do you know what an abbacus is? In order to work, you need the beads. In LN, in order to send or receive, you have to add your own "beads"
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This is the best answer for a 5 years old kid to understand! The abacus!
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How do I get those beads?
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21 sats \ 1 reply \ @fm 16 Sep
Those beads are your bitcoin and you commit those beads by opening channels
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Or sometimes by paying someone to open a channel to you. But then all the beads are on their side, so you cannot spend anything (no beads on your side), only receive money.
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Try https://helm-wallet.com/, the Lightning wallet even your grandma can use.
Your grandma doesn't need to manage any liquidity, it just works.
If you have any issue, reply to this post and I will try to help you.
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Hah! Looks intriguing, I'll look into it!
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@CHADBot /eli5 explain the concept of inbound/outbound liquidity on the bitcoin lightning network as if I'm 5
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21 sats \ 0 replies \ @CHADBot 16 Sep bot
You have summoned CHADBot. Please zap this post 21 sats to receive service.
Made with 🧡 by CASCDR
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0 sats \ 3 replies \ @CHADBot 16 Sep bot
Sure, imagine you have a piggy bank that works a bit differently. This piggy bank has two sides: an 'inbound' side, where people can put money in, and an 'outbound' side, where you can take money out. In Bitcoin Lightning network, 'inbound liquidity' refers to how much money people can send to you (put in your 'inbound' side), whereas 'outbound liquidity' refers to how much money you can send to others (take out from your 'outbound' side). They need to be balanced for things to work smoothly. If you can't send money, you might not have enough in your 'outbound' side. If people can't send you money, you might need more room in your 'inbound' side.
Made with 🧡 by CASCDR
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Without inbound I can't even receive?
@cascdr the bot is pretty cool tho.
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That's right. The abacus beads need to be on your channel partner's side in order for them to send it to you!
It's challenging bc to some extent you're still beholden to on-chain and to someone offering their utxo to give you the ability to receive. LSPs have helped a lot and there's more innovation coming. I am wondering if there's more layers yet to be built that could further insulate consumers and newbies from the headaches though.
Hustle thinks you should just try out Albyhub/Alby Go and open a large channel with zeus.
You'll have a lightning address, wallet and node with enough liquidity to send and receive.
Play around with Nostr Wallet Connect.
Best of luck.
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Imagine you have a tulip garden, and your inbound liquidity is like the empty space in your garden where friends can plant tulip bulbs for you. If your garden has room (inbound liquidity), people can come by and plant more tulips (send you Bitcoin). However, as more tulips are planted (you receive more Bitcoin), your garden gets fuller, leaving less space for others to add more tulips until you decide to dig some up and give them to others (send Bitcoin out), freeing up room again.
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Receiving decreases inbound, spending increases inbound, isn't the above the inverse of that?
It's not ment to be used as a cheaper savings vehicle then, is it?
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Without reading every guide, I’d say you can get inbound liquidity by making channels and then sending some out to your phone wallet. This will give your channels a remote balance (inbound liquidity)
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There is no credit in Bitcoin land.
To send money, you must have outbound. i.e. you have put money into a channel with someone else.
To receive money, you must have inbound. i.e. someone has put money into a channel with you.
Simple as.
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So if I send 100k to SN, I have new inbound liquidity?
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Yes.
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And how is the amount of liquidity calculated?
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Now I know how it must feel when I tell people a bit about how Bitcoin works... 🤭
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I thought you said you kept your sats on here?
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People can't frickin' DM me.
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Now I'm a piss-poor SN-pleb.
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I've had to get a wallet going because, well, I've sold a Pouch on here and had to have a place to make an invoice, thus the stone started rolling, and I've said "fuck this", I'm going to restore full functionality on SN and dip my toes in LN.
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Interesting. I wish there was a way to go directly from here onto the main chain. That would be nice.
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