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1156 sats \ 20 replies \ @Public_N_M_E 23 May \ on: Which territories will not survive next month? And next year? oracle
V4V is a tough nut to crack. Everyone wants return on investment, you want value back so you give value, the problem is the value you get in return is so small it doesn't come close to helping foot the bill.
Econ I believe managed to reach profitability. But the posting fees are like 1500sats per post. I don't think I can justify 1500 per post in ~Music. That's far higher than the "normal" posting fees from before territorys existed. If, to make a territory self sustainable you require 150x what was considered the "normal" posting fees, that whole model needs looking at.
Posting content is low in my territory but engagement is high in comments. If I were able to adjust the comments/reply fees I think I could make my way to sustainability as a territory. Replies are 1sat per post. But to post a discussion or something is the only adjustable fee, people are chatting away and engaging with each other for 1sat per comment, but very few posts get posted, the ability to make the comment/reply fees adjustable might really help. Perhaps that's something for @k00b and the Devs to consider implementing?
It was mentioned before by another user but territory owners might benefit from being able to post/comment in their territory for free, but I think that idea got shot down when it was raised.
All in all, if you want to be a founder of a territory you just have to accept that this isn't going to fund itself, 1 territory out of 50 something, with even more archived that have fallen at the hurdles, being self sustainable? That's not going to work, especially if the way to self sustainability is to have fees 150x greater than what was considered "normal" posting fees.
TLDR be prepared to bleed sats for something you're passionate about, don't get into this for the money, there isn't any 🤣
~Econ only costs 100 sats for a post, but it's also the one territory I know of that crowdfunds.
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That’s right. There are a handful of us paying the the shortfall every month.
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it is a great initiative and look's like is the only territory doing so. @Jeff strategized a lot to make it happen, and I think it would be useful for other territory owners to try the same approach.
Atm it's possible to support only the reward pool, it wouldn't be nice to have a way to directly support territories too?
@Public_N_M_E would you consider testing the same approach?
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It's certainly something I'm considering, the difficulty is finding time to ensure I'm available to interact with a crowdfund.
Effectively every single one of my daily posts and my various weeklies should act as a crowdfund if they were to be zapped proportionate to comments and engagement 😉
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It's suggestive of what will be possible over time. Those guys are innovators, but as SN grows, and there's non-trivial money / influence to be had by effective territory management, I think you'll see more "overlays" of this kind, groups of people specializing in different aspects of territory mgmt. @siggy47 is another example of innovation in territory-running.
Things that don't seem viable now will likely be later.
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That's true, but doing so you'll never know if the funds will be re-invested in the territory or not.
I also notice that most territory owners are just sitting back, maybe watching, maybe just forgot about SN. Anyway, just thinking that potentially, territories should have a dedicated wallet that the owner (and other contributors could) have access to.
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Sitting back, nah you gotta invest your time if you want to succeed, spend some time in ~Music and ~Stacker_Sports ~Agora is another. Very very active owners.
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I love this idea. At the end of the month, if folks have contributed, say, 10K sats to the wallet, the owner gets billed 90K.
Unless they're yearlong or lifetime territories, I can't imagine many active territories have owners that have really abandoned them, since that monthly bill would keep coming up.
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My mistake, apologies, there was a territory that made it to profitability, but their posting fees were about 1500. But the name escapes me.
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Man, now I'm curious about which one. I know ~podcasts charged 1K (which is pretty much why I never posted there, in addition to the fact that most podcasts I want to share make sense in specific territories), but it looks like it's also archived.
I would be willing to post something for 10 or even 21 sats even comment
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Same, I think most of the users in my territory wouldn't care if a comment fee was 21sats or 10sats rather than 1 sat. I think the people I interact with are less bothered by price and more just enjoy the space I provide to chill and listen/share music.
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same for me, I would not care much. There's any reason why replying is set at 1sat specifically? @k00b
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Thanks for detailing the current situation on ~Music and I agree the value for territories reside in the comments, not really in the value you get back as sats.
It was mentioned before by another user but territory owners might benefit from being able to post/comment in their territory for free, but I think that idea got shot down when it was raised.
Can you remember where it was discussed? I think the idea to comment back for a fee (higher than 1 sat) could be a great feature, and a way to keep conversations cleaner helping stackers think twice before hitting reply.
What I can notice in most territories is also a really low value on amount of comments per post. I assume it's really hard to create spaces for conversation, but maybe is just my impression.
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I think it may have been siggy? Who posted about "thoughts on territories" I thought I saw it on similar when I hit reply, but as a mobile user, finding anything is impossible 🤣. Might have been this one #389003
I'm having the opposite issue in music than lack of comments, I'm getting 20ish a day and great engagement, but no zaps on the post at all. Where I see some stackers find their way to 1000s of sats a day, without even making a post... The reward leaderboard really spelled it out for me.
I had 30posts, stacked about the same as I spent, but was sat in the same bracket as users with 1 or even zero posts. Hell I've made more sats in the main saloon dropping salute emojis on posts I want to show respect to. Users zapping a salute emoji gives me better return than actually posting anything. That either tells me that no one cares about my content (possible) or people aren't zapping value they're just blanket zapping lots of stuff to try to game the rewards. There's for sure some... Teething issues ... with the V4V model.
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That's frustrating to hear; I zap the daily posts in music (and in stackersports) because they're part of what gives the territory its personality. Same with the weekly wrap-ups in other territories I follow (like booksandarticles).
Rewarding zapping is obviously a good thing, but I do think the model would benefit from folks not being as able to game it.
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Yep. But I appreciate you showing up everyday and giving me something to listen to 👊
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