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51 sats \ 4 replies \ @Scoresby OP 15h \ parent \ on: The real poverty line in the US isn't $31,200: it's $140,000 - Michael Green econ
Sure, but all the jobs I've had experience with pull some significant share of the premium from your paycheck.
If you figure two kids, two years apart, you get 8 years of putting career on hold (assuming kids go to school at 6). I don't believe he accounted for the cost of 8 years' career delay at all.
Speaking as a parent who did full-time child care for 8 years, it does put a pretty good hurting on ones' career.
I'm inclined to believe actual poverty line is closer to $140k than to $30k for a family of four.
Let's do a family of 4 in Los Angeles, where I live. I'll use numbers that probably don't even approach poverty levels...
Rent: $3,000/mo = $36,000/yr
Food (including dining out): $50/day = $18,250/yr
Shopping (including clothes): $200/mo = $2,400/yr
Car Payments: $400/mo = $4,800/yr
Auto Insurance: $200/mo = $2,400/yr
Gas: $150/mo = $1,800/yr
Mobile: $30/mo (for 2 adults) = $360/yr
Internet: $80/mo = $960/yr
Utilities: $120/mo = $1,440/yr
Entertainment (incl subscriptions): $80/mo = $960/yr
Health Insurance: $200/mo = $2,400/yr
Healthcare Out of Pocket: $2,000/yr
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Total: $73,770 / yr
I'm sure I'm missing some categories, but it's also pretty generous (good standard of living, not scraping by---though the apartment may feel cramped), and this isn't even close to approaching $140k/yr
You could even add on $25,000 for daycare (which I think is a bit much, there should be cheaper options available including family and partially remote work) and it wouldn't crack $100k
Poverty is meant to measure when someone can no longer even survive or function within society, it is not meant to be a measure of a "Decent standard of living" or "able to pursue a fulfilling career while raising a family"
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You make some good points, however there are also taxes. I think $100k pretax income for a family of 4 is indeed near some level of hardship.
My wife and I had three kids in Seattle on a $70k income and it was tight. I'm pretty frugal, so I made it work. But it was never comfortable and we definitely weren't saving, despite this being 2018. It probably wasn't poverty, but it's not a good feeling to cut most every corner and know that you still are counting on nothing going wrong.
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I agree, I don't think $100k would be comfortable. I don't know if I'd use the word "harship", but I do quite like the word "precarious" to describe it, and some economists have even described this class as the precariat. Meaning, they earn enough to make a decent living, but not enough to build up a cushion, and if they get hit with an emergency expense it could spiral them.
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I harp on this because a lot of the socialist support for people like AOC and Mamdani comes from well educated young adults whose lives are actually ok but they act like some great injustice was done to them.
Yes, there is plenty to be mad about in our current economic system, but I feel like the narrative just gets more and more exaggerated
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