reply on: Square terminals to accept lightning \ stacker news ~bitcoin

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74 sats \ 10 replies \ @Solomonsatoshi 27 May \ parent \ on: Square terminals to accept lightning bitcoin

How can you reasonably expect regulatory approval when virtually none of the spenders will be compliant with current tax law obligations?

MoE use of Bitcoin/LN requires extraordinary recording and tax calculations which render it effectively impractical to achieve in a legally compliant manner.

This is no accident- it is the fiat operators protecting their invaluable MoE hegemony. This is the sly obstruction of bitcoin MoE adoption.

17 sats \ 7 replies \ @Catcher 27 May

They can start with Europe;)

0 sats \ 6 replies \ @Solomonsatoshi 27 May

Are capital gains on Bitcoin not taxed in Europe?

93 sats \ 5 replies \ @Catcher 27 May

There are nuances, depends on the country, holding period, total amount you sold, etc. I’ve talked to tax consultant recently and she told me it’s such a grey area, that for now it’s mostly ignored, unless you are transacting in hundreds of thousands.

69 sats \ 4 replies \ @Solomonsatoshi 27 May

So they 'allow' small traders to operate under the radar but any larger retailer is going to have accountants/tax consultants who will advise that while the retailer itself may not be breaching tax law, as long as they convert immediately upon transaction to fiat, their customers mostly will not likely be recording, reporting and paying the tax due on their purchases. The retailer thus could risk being identified as enabling/association with tax evasion by its customers. Most large retailers will run a mile from taking such a risk of association with tax code violation. The whole thing is slyly intended to 'discourage' (obstruct) adoption by retailers by making legally compliant retail level MoE use of Bitcoin effectively impractical.

252 sats \ 3 replies \ @Catcher 27 May

I wonder how it’s aligned with recent announcement that Spar accepts bitcoin now. Also this logic could also be used for any cash transaction, but it’s not. if I’m accepting cash, it’s not my responsibility to check if you have paid taxes on this cash or you just didn’t declare you cash earnings

5 sats \ 2 replies \ @Solomonsatoshi 27 May

Cash is legal tender. Bitcoin is not. Use of cash for payment implies zero capital gain tax obligations upon the spender or the receiver. A retailer cannot reasonably be expected to check the source of cash used by customers but a retailer could, arguably, be expected to know that most Bitcoin customers will not be complying with the absurdly onerous tax recording and reporting obligations that apply to Bitcoin.

Bitcoin is effectively impractical for legal use as a MoE- this is the tax law in almost all jurisdictions where it is not explicitly outlawed.

Spar is taking an apparently bold stand and is almost certainly instantly converting sats received to fiat to avoid its own direct CGT reporting requirements but does risk unwelcome attention from tax authorities. If their acceptance of Bitcoin fails to deliver worthwhile increased sales they might quietly drop the offering.

Over time several retailers have briefly accepted Bitcoin to then drop it as insufficient additional turnover results.

'Oh look Spar accept Bitcoin- we live in a liberal and free market democracy' No, MoE adoption has been successfully obstructed and few if any of the isolated cases of large adoptees of acceptance have enjoyed sufficient support to sustain their acceptance.

The sly obstruction of Bitcoin MoE is being done subtly to prevent mass scale adoption that would be a threat to fiat- so far this has been largely successful, and no ugly outright ban has been required.