I think in a domain of sufficient size, you see all things at once; or maybe: what started as a singular subculture becomes an entire teeming ecosystem. Wrt btc, the geeks are still geeking; the mops are everywhere, with their podcasts and personal brands and vanity startups; and the sociopaths are issuing debt and playing geopolitics.

People insist that we're early. Seems right. Others insist that everything has changed. Also seems right. It's a particle, it's a wave.

I think, along lines of the 2nd essay that there is a cyclic nature to this, and we're in a later cycle of mops and sociopaths. Sociopaths are already here and probably a first wave (or 2nd or third) of sociopaths have come and gone. Bitcoin isn't just an idea, it also produces stuff (Bitcoin, which has economic worth for now at least) so we've ratcheted up at least a few times.

The 2nd essay mentioned a lull leading to institutionalism and I think we're about there with this US crypto summit. Also if one buys the premise that sociopaths are drawn to power, nation states and secret services are definitely sociopaths in this framework. Who's to say what happens when/if they get a quantum computer powered by brainoids or something.

I'm not sure that there's a subculture and I think that it'd be (too) easy to label everything that happens that we individually or as a small group of likeminded fellas don't agree with as sociopath. There will always be exploitation but one does not need a subculture for that. I'm convinced that there are tons and tons of sociopaths in the Bitcoin space; very successful ones too.

I also think that the Bitcoin concept and subsequent implementation wasn't really intended to create a subculture; the relevant subculture was already there: the cypherpunk one. Bitcoin is simply one of the products of that subculture; a, if not the, prominent product.

Back to the sociopaths, because they are there but there isn't a clear subculture (at least not to me), I worry that instead there are cults, which is how I feel when some of those iconic "Bitcoiners" of these days speak on stage or podcasts. But then again, maybe I'm just labelling people that I disagree with.

The 2nd essay's focus on cycles also makes me think about Bitcoin as a cyclical transition currency (it has the 4 year cycle) as a tool to avoid violent overthrow of the social order. Sociopaths benefit from having a highly observable money all wrapped up with a predictable development of subculture(s)

I'd have to think a bit about this some more before I commit to an answer, but my knee-jerk response would probably be something similar to what Lopp said¹ in that interview you shared earlier today (#960687). He makes the case that, during each of Bitcoin's hype cycles, the new adoptors that buy in tend to take on some of the worst ideas that plagued previous adoption waves. I would add that there's likely an element of all three (mops, geeks, and socios) during these cycles, at least now. Mops turn to shitcoins and custodial 'solutions,' allured by rent-seeking 'socios,' while the geeks/creatives and even fanatics stay mostly fixed on the innovating. Considering Trump is discussing Bitcoin, we might be approaching peak socio-stage.

But I generally agree with that subcultures are dead.²

This seems like stages 1, 2, and 3 of the Gartner Hype Cycle, but for subcultures instead of technology adoption.

It's interesting how the same social dynamics are present in so many things.

I'll take the dark side here and say socios

Thank you for the essays

Ugh, accidentally zapped this when trying to scroll.

lol!

I went to church this evening and prayed for these people. Some of them I know and others I have met in person. Being a founder in this space is not easy it tests your morals, principles and character. I do think the article forgot to mention reputational capital that is something the Bitcoin community does have, some choose to remember others don’t, depending on the severity. Collectives are the best way to combat socio’s that and couple other things. ☺️

i m geek, mops and sociopaths as simple it s :) so i won t click ;)