deezy: effects of going zero fee on my routing node
894 sats \ 15 comments \ @dannydeezy 5 Sep 2022 bitcoin
recently i went 0-fee on the deezy lightning node, what has happened:
  • volume explodes
  • more nodes open channels to you
  • your good liquidity gets drained
the liquidity getting drained makes it so i'm not as good of a routing node. in the future, i may experiment with a hybrid 0-fee model... 0-fees as long as the channel balance remains at least 50% on my side or something. if too much goes outbound, fee on the channel gets increased.
what other ideas are interesting?
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1355 sats \ 5 replies \ @orenams1 6 Sep 2022
I'm basically zero-fees, this is my stats: https://manreo.github.io/
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116 sats \ 1 reply \ @faithandcredit 6 Sep 2022
Looks like it has forwarded 21 BTC with only 1.1 BTC in channel capacity
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11 sats \ 0 replies \ @orenams1 6 Sep 2022
yes : )
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100 sats \ 1 reply \ @pillar 6 Sep 2022
That's awesome. Is the code for this page open source?
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320 sats \ 0 replies \ @orenams1 6 Sep 2022
yes open-source, see here: https://github.com/manreo/lightning-datascience/tree/main/node_info but it currently works only with core-lightning
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100 sats \ 0 replies \ @dannydeezy OP 6 Sep 2022
wow this is awesome!
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130 sats \ 0 replies \ @Wumbo 6 Sep 2022
I would add: Be patient. I have been inclined to lower fees after there has been a week of low traffic. Only to see traffic pick back up with out making any changes.
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110 sats \ 0 replies \ @higuyslol 6 Sep 2022
I’ve been trying to be very public with my fees, I list them in my Amboss node page.
Without making any substantial changes otherwise, I’ve noticed a major uptick in people opening channels to me, even for a small node like mine.
It’d be awesome if Amboss support markdown in their description or something, formatting is a bitch.
Plug: https://amboss.space/node/02d6863821d2941c894493d910269bde16d35673efbbb16f21a67e91650348f1d5
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110 sats \ 0 replies \ @glix 6 Sep 2022
The draining liquidity part is so real. It happens very very quickly lol. I wasn't able to use your swap service for even 100k sats the other day. The dynamic fees route sounds the most logical to me. That way, it will protect the last remaining liquidity from unnecessary usage and only allow nodes who actually want to use it meaningfully. I think zero fee routing (the node) disables the channel altogether itself when they don't have more than 50% on their side (they might have changed this strategy now, not sure)
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10 sats \ 0 replies \ @DarthCoin 6 Sep 2022
My experiment with fees
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @tenuous 6 Sep 2022
Thanks, updates like these are really helpful.
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0 sats \ 1 reply \ @kilianbuhn 6 Sep 2022
liquidity gets drained? Why don't you rebalance frequently?
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @dannydeezy OP 6 Sep 2022
i'm playing around with rebalancing strategies, but when i'm charge zero fees, there is not much of a budget to use for rebalancing
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0 sats \ 1 reply \ @notgeld 6 Sep 2022
It is very contradictory to your other advice. Practically it means that you provide liquidity for those who rebalance frequently.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @dannydeezy OP 6 Sep 2022
true. my other advice (buy low, sell high) requires one to charge fees. i've only been zero-fee for the last 2-3 weeks or so as an experiment
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