Covid vaccines don't prevent you from being infected, but they do prevent it from developing into a serious case. At least that's what the experts said.
technically, covid 'vaccines' (at least mRNA 'vaccines') are not vaccines. The concept of a vaccine involves using weakened microorganisms that stimulate the body's defenses.
I know. I am proudly unvaccinated. When Biden came out with his grim "winter of death" speech that was the last straw for me with the whole government. But @0xbitcoiner usually has good information, so I want to hear him out.
I'm not an expert, what I'm saying is what I've heard from some experts who haven't been radicalized about covid.
"...was 95% effective in protecting against COVID-19 disease, ..."
What I interpret from this sentence is that 95% of people don't get sick, but that doesn't mean you can't get infected. You can be infected and not be sick. Of course, I could be wrong.
Yes, that is what I heard also, but not until a year later. It might have been a marketing thing, but there is no question that at the time that article came out the assertion was that if you got the vaccination, you would not get covid, unless you were amongst the unlucky 5%.
I think (noting that I'm NOT a scientist) that actually means that in 95% of exposures to the virus, it will prevent it. That's not quite the same as 95% of the people, since most folks get exposed multiple times.
That's because you think of this 95% efficacy as absolute (as it should for any other vaccine approval) but both Pfizer and Moderna reported relative % efficacy and pretended it was absolute. The real efficacy is below 1% which explains why in reality the vaccines didn't make a difference, or one can also argue they made things worse by getting in the way of natural immunity against a weakening virus
correct, they always said is voluntary and that if you take it you will not die (but if you do, then you get your money back...lol) was never meant to prevent it.
You are correct. Yet the masses were lied to. Told they were safe and effective vaccines. Once it was clear they didn't prevent infection the goal posts changed. The lying just never stopped. I never had a problem with the treatments. By that I mean that they existed and were available. But the idea that they were ever vaccines is a lie.
We are told to trust authorities but they lie over and over again. Then the authorities blame the Internet for their loss of credibility. They did it to themselves.
PCR detects traces of DNA or RNA. It's used as a proxy. The accuracy is mega high though for a specific target. But viruses are evolving constantly. Within a single person, virus population are very heterogenous. So when the test works, the presence is clear. When it doesn't, there could be variants of the target or no virus at all.
The result of a person receiving this vaccine is that their immune system will ultimately react defensively to the virus that causes COVID-19.
The vaccine is effective in preventing COVID-19 and potentially serious outcomes including hospitalization and death.
Once again, I must emphasize that it's possible to be infected without being sick. Many people, even before the vaccines, were infected but did not develop symptoms.
No argument there. You can certainly get infected without being sick. Your quote, further down in the release, says "and", not "or". No point in arguing semantics, since my point is that whether the vaccine was effective and how it was effective seems secondary to the marketing of the vaccine, and the mandates that came soon after as the efficacy expectations were lowered.
It's not about knowing or not knowing. It's about risk management in the face of uncertainty. Epidemics caused by a new disease with new variants are a dynamic system. Knowledge is partial.
Yet, we were presented with black and whites over and over again. The idea was there were the authorities and the nuts. That was way off. Disadents were attacked. It was top down authoritatian action. Much not based in science but pitched like it was.
And the "authorities" setting the policy were also trying to cover up their funding of the research that created the virus. Most insane conflict of interest imaginable.
The experts are the one keeping you alive. The science behind vaccines, virology and immunology is the same science used by ER doctors, cancerlogists or aircraft engineers. Your issue is not with science or experts, it is with statistics, which you don't understand.
My terse response to people during Covid when people asked me about it was,
"I just do not trust liars"
I know that's kinda crazy but once someone lies to me I just can't take anything they say at face value. I do not understand how people can be lied to over and over again by authority figures and still seem to trust them. It something that seriously makes me question the IQ of most people.
This is also a good way to short circuit red|blue team nonsense with friends. If you know how both sides have lied you can get the topic changed really quick. Unless you enjoy hearing people parrot talking points this is a good skill to have.
Its all so absurd. Dude is shady. I remember listening to him being questioned by a good interviewer during the peak of Covid. Was asking him good questions and Fauci didn't lie outright but he was very deceptive with his answers. Anyone that didn't understand how the MRNA shots were different from previous vaccines would be completely misinformed. It was my final straw with this guy. At that point I could never consider him just wrong. He knowingly deceived the masses. The more I leaned about him the more it made sense.
The sad thing is so many still do not understand how deep the rot goes. As with most issues with government it gets pulled into the red|blue team dynamics and people fall into their programming.
And Trump fans like to gloss over his part in all this. I will never forget.
I recall telling a friend that Fauci and the media were the sales guys. Glossing over details. Changing the messaging to avoid scaring people. Those of us that would read the long documents on these "treatments" that dated back to before the pandemic would see how they changed the marketing to avoid freaking people out.
Then they would use the stats for traditional vaccines comparing them to a first ever mass use mRNA gene therapy treatment. I recall reading the S1 filing from Moderna which referred to these treatments as genetic therapies. Then listened to the marketing teams deny this. It was truly disgusting to watch the masses being deceived in real time. I never had a problem with people being able to choose to get whatever treatment they desired. They should be fully informed and be able to make the choice about how they want to treat their own bodies. But that wasn't how it went down.
These people care about two things. Wealth and power. The evil on display was truly disgusting. Massive amounts of money were made and these evil men will always claim they were trying to save the world but I don't believe it. Those scientist that have done the work are not the ones selling it. But those with platforms, they know what they have done.
I know it's an unpopular opinion here but that's simply not true. It's true today, but it wasn't always so- as someone who was there running the first COVID units from the beginning, I always reassure patients by stating I have not had to call the ICU for a truly sick COVID patient since February of 2022. Before that it was almost every day. Things changed after Omicron.
Before Omicron, throughout most of the Delta wave, I was taking care of 90% unvaccinated patients and a handful of severely immunocompromised patients (transplant etc). After Omicron, vaccinated or not, people simply have not been sick. I haven't seen any of the characteristic X-Ray and CT findings we saw through 2021. Any sick patients in early 2022 were likely residual Delta cases.
Unfortunately twitter/rogan etc is full of clout chasing virologists and epidemiologists and short on front line workers who actually cared for patients throughout the pandemic.
The problem for me is how do we know if someone actually has covid? Because the PCR tests have been inappropriately used, aren’t accurate and according to Dr Kary Mullis who invented the technology ‘PCR cannot be used to diagnose disease’. So if Fauci is genuinely unwell it seems plausible it’s because he’s had six shots or has a regular flu.
That's why I say 'Covid was created for vaccines'. With such news coming out every now and then, I feel so relaxed for my decision of not being vaccinated and not letting any of the other 4 members of my family being vaccinated. Any of us five had never been tested and for our best knowledge we never had covid.
Lies, lies, lies from the beginning. Fauci and the NIH demonising known antivirals to pave the way for accelerated vaccine approval (i.e., no fast track for drug approval if there is an alternative treatment). It doesn't take more than 5 s to check that Ivermectin (whether it worked or not for Covid is irrelevant, what matters is the lies and brainwash from the media and health authorities) has been a life-saving medicine for decades and won the Medicine Nobel prize in 2015. Another big lie is the 95% efficacy portrayed as absolute (as it should for any other vaccine approval) but both Pfizer and Moderna reported relative % efficacy and pretended it was absolute, the bigger the lie the more people will believe it, right? The real efficacy is below 1% which explains why in reality the vaccines didn't make a difference, or one can also argue that they made things worse by getting in the way of natural immunity against a weakening virus
"How the 95% mRNA vaccine efficacy was mostly fabricated but nobody looked"
But this clown discovered a great money making scheme, based on 'science', top propaganda, the desire of virtue signaling of the little man and stupidity. All respect to this man!
And he was right. It might have taken a bit longer than he predicted but that's basically what happened as the virus mutated and became weaker. Only the sheep who got vaxxed and boosted seem to get in now.
Mutations aren't the main reason. Pretty much the entire population has been infected, making the virus less dangerous because we all have some degree of immunity. Unfortunately there is evidence that people who got vaccinated have less immunity than unvaccinated, due to immune system imprinting on the wrong strains. But even then they're still less susceptible than a naive person getting infected for the first time.
This is true of most highly contagious illnesses: you get infected first as a kid, when you're relatively resistant to disease, and those antibodies keep you reasonable healthy for the rest of your life. Even in old age, when otherwise illnesses could do you a lot more harm. In some cases we have effective vaccines, and can shortcut the process by ensuring kids are unharmed by their first infection.
I've been infected for sure at least once (tested covid+), and was probably infected again recently (exposed to confirmed covid+). The first time was a flu with a moderate fever and an awful headache. The second time barely even qualified as a cold.
The first time I had it I had the worst headache and fever. But I didnt take the vaccine, so it should hit me hard. After that, I was fine. I dont think I have gotten it since!
Covid vaccines don't prevent you from being infected, but they do prevent it from developing into a serious case. At least that's what the experts said.
Maybe that's my problem. When I was growing up vaccines were given to prevent you from getting a specific disease. Polio, measles, mumps, etc.
technically, covid 'vaccines' (at least mRNA 'vaccines') are not vaccines. The concept of a vaccine involves using weakened microorganisms that stimulate the body's defenses.
So these shots were not manufactured to prevent you from getting covid?
No, it's so that the infection doesn't develop into a very serious situation.
Check out this article:
https://time.com/5920134/first-authorized-covid-19-vaccine-us/
It says 95% effective in preventing covid. That would make it a vaccine, no, if it worked?
not if it is mRNA
95 percent effective for how many days or weeks?
The problem is covid mutates and then the 'vaccine' is 0 percent effective
I know. I am proudly unvaccinated. When Biden came out with his grim "winter of death" speech that was the last straw for me with the whole government. But @0xbitcoiner usually has good information, so I want to hear him out.
Good points. Remember when they called them "breakthrough cases"? That ended quickly as the numbers piled up.
I'm not an expert, what I'm saying is what I've heard from some experts who haven't been radicalized about covid.
"...was 95% effective in protecting against COVID-19 disease, ..."
What I interpret from this sentence is that 95% of people don't get sick, but that doesn't mean you can't get infected. You can be infected and not be sick. Of course, I could be wrong.
Yes, that is what I heard also, but not until a year later. It might have been a marketing thing, but there is no question that at the time that article came out the assertion was that if you got the vaccination, you would not get covid, unless you were amongst the unlucky 5%.
I think (noting that I'm NOT a scientist) that actually means that in 95% of exposures to the virus, it will prevent it. That's not quite the same as 95% of the people, since most folks get exposed multiple times.
That's because you think of this 95% efficacy as absolute (as it should for any other vaccine approval) but both Pfizer and Moderna reported relative % efficacy and pretended it was absolute. The real efficacy is below 1% which explains why in reality the vaccines didn't make a difference, or one can also argue they made things worse by getting in the way of natural immunity against a weakening virus
#575156
https://m.stacker.news/45620
that's a lie
correct, they always said is voluntary and that if you take it you will not die (but if you do, then you get your money back...lol) was never meant to prevent it.
Moderna is a shady company bordering on criminal
All their products use mRNA
Can't spell Moderna with m R N A
the boosters were a sign of failure: mRNA shots do not work
Coronavirus mutates too quickly for any 'vaccine' to be efficacious
started in 2010
IPO in 2018
never received FDA approval until their covid shot
You are correct. Yet the masses were lied to. Told they were safe and effective vaccines. Once it was clear they didn't prevent infection the goal posts changed. The lying just never stopped. I never had a problem with the treatments. By that I mean that they existed and were available. But the idea that they were ever vaccines is a lie.
We are told to trust authorities but they lie over and over again. Then the authorities blame the Internet for their loss of credibility. They did it to themselves.
A lie told once remains a lie. A lie told a thousand times becomes the truth.
PCR cannot detect disease
At least that's what the guy who invented it said.
PCR detects traces of DNA or RNA. It's used as a proxy.
The accuracy is mega high though for a specific target. But viruses are evolving constantly. Within a single person, virus population are very heterogenous. So when the test works, the presence is clear. When it doesn't, there could be variants of the target or no virus at all.
tetanus, whooping cough
Here's the original FDA news release:
https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-approves-first-covid-19-vaccine
So, The FDA did claim it was 91% effective in preventing covid. No mention about reducing severity. This morphed over time.
Once again, I must emphasize that it's possible to be infected without being sick. Many people, even before the vaccines, were infected but did not develop symptoms.
No argument there. You can certainly get infected without being sick. Your quote, further down in the release, says "and", not "or". No point in arguing semantics, since my point is that whether the vaccine was effective and how it was effective seems secondary to the marketing of the vaccine, and the mandates that came soon after as the efficacy expectations were lowered.
The mandates were another sign that mRNA/spike protein shots had too many questions about safety and efficacy
Asymptomatic cases were common especially children
Aug 23, 2021
3 years ago almost exactly
I'm getting angry all over again.
I know what you mean
I need to stop debating people about covid and mRNA and efficacy
The problem is the experts said many things including that. The truth is they didn't know but acted like they did.
It's not about knowing or not knowing. It's about risk management in the face of uncertainty. Epidemics caused by a new disease with new variants are a dynamic system. Knowledge is partial.
Yet, we were presented with black and whites over and over again. The idea was there were the authorities and the nuts. That was way off. Disadents were attacked. It was top down authoritatian action. Much not based in science but pitched like it was.
And the "authorities" setting the policy were also trying to cover up their funding of the research that created the virus. Most insane conflict of interest imaginable.
The experts are incompetent liars
The experts are the one keeping you alive. The science behind vaccines, virology and immunology is the same science used by ER doctors, cancerlogists or aircraft engineers. Your issue is not with science or experts, it is with statistics, which you don't understand.
Cancerlogists? What is this of which you speak?
https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/cancerology
That's oncology, if you prefer.
How can you take anyone who throws a ball like this seriously?
https://m.stacker.news/45486
That's all the proof I need
truth
insult to injury, case closed!
My terse response to people during Covid when people asked me about it was,
"I just do not trust liars"
I know that's kinda crazy but once someone lies to me I just can't take anything they say at face value. I do not understand how people can be lied to over and over again by authority figures and still seem to trust them. It something that seriously makes me question the IQ of most people.
This is also a good way to short circuit red|blue team nonsense with friends. If you know how both sides have lied you can get the topic changed really quick. Unless you enjoy hearing people parrot talking points this is a good skill to have.
Or put another way, do not trust the government.
Many are allergic to that phrase.
There are a lot of sheep in the world.
I believe it's the majority. Another flaw with Democracy.
The problem is that people dont know how to think for themselves.
Its all so absurd. Dude is shady. I remember listening to him being questioned by a good interviewer during the peak of Covid. Was asking him good questions and Fauci didn't lie outright but he was very deceptive with his answers. Anyone that didn't understand how the MRNA shots were different from previous vaccines would be completely misinformed. It was my final straw with this guy. At that point I could never consider him just wrong. He knowingly deceived the masses. The more I leaned about him the more it made sense.
The sad thing is so many still do not understand how deep the rot goes. As with most issues with government it gets pulled into the red|blue team dynamics and people fall into their programming.
And Trump fans like to gloss over his part in all this. I will never forget.
I recall telling a friend that Fauci and the media were the sales guys. Glossing over details. Changing the messaging to avoid scaring people. Those of us that would read the long documents on these "treatments" that dated back to before the pandemic would see how they changed the marketing to avoid freaking people out.
Then they would use the stats for traditional vaccines comparing them to a first ever mass use mRNA gene therapy treatment. I recall reading the S1 filing from Moderna which referred to these treatments as genetic therapies. Then listened to the marketing teams deny this. It was truly disgusting to watch the masses being deceived in real time. I never had a problem with people being able to choose to get whatever treatment they desired. They should be fully informed and be able to make the choice about how they want to treat their own bodies. But that wasn't how it went down.
These people care about two things. Wealth and power. The evil on display was truly disgusting. Massive amounts of money were made and these evil men will always claim they were trying to save the world but I don't believe it. Those scientist that have done the work are not the ones selling it. But those with platforms, they know what they have done.
Yes, this is what really got to me.
If they would have been honest about it, and offered it to willing people, that would have been so much better.
Right, he was the one who did the "warpspeed" thing.
Covid is just another flu. Always has been.
I know it's an unpopular opinion here but that's simply not true. It's true today, but it wasn't always so- as someone who was there running the first COVID units from the beginning, I always reassure patients by stating I have not had to call the ICU for a truly sick COVID patient since February of 2022. Before that it was almost every day. Things changed after Omicron.
Before Omicron, throughout most of the Delta wave, I was taking care of 90% unvaccinated patients and a handful of severely immunocompromised patients (transplant etc). After Omicron, vaccinated or not, people simply have not been sick. I haven't seen any of the characteristic X-Ray and CT findings we saw through 2021. Any sick patients in early 2022 were likely residual Delta cases.
Unfortunately twitter/rogan etc is full of clout chasing virologists and epidemiologists and short on front line workers who actually cared for patients throughout the pandemic.
How many patients survived ICU?
What was median age of those patients?
Were they obese or suffering from diabetes and hypertension?
*Lab engineered flu
Crazy how many people fell for the vaccine. I almost did...
I think this was one of the biggest psy-ops in american history
The problem for me is how do we know if someone actually has covid? Because the PCR tests have been inappropriately used, aren’t accurate and according to Dr Kary Mullis who invented the technology ‘PCR cannot be used to diagnose disease’.
So if Fauci is genuinely unwell it seems plausible it’s because he’s had six shots or has a regular flu.
Few understand how PCR tests work.
Look. Please don't cloud the issue with facts 😀
Everyone who gets vaccinated has infected himself with the virus. In some sense!
It's like saying that chicken nuggets are a running breathing chicken in some sense.
That's why I say 'Covid was created for vaccines'. With such news coming out every now and then, I feel so relaxed for my decision of not being vaccinated and not letting any of the other 4 members of my family being vaccinated. Any of us five had never been tested and for our best knowledge we never had covid.
someone needs to kill him with a bullet
No one will investigate
cause of death: covid
If a normal person has COVID this many times, his ticket to heaven has already been issued! But he's dr Fauci!
Do you know Dr. Faustus!
Lies, lies, lies from the beginning. Fauci and the NIH demonising known antivirals to pave the way for accelerated vaccine approval (i.e., no fast track for drug approval if there is an alternative treatment). It doesn't take more than 5 s to check that Ivermectin (whether it worked or not for Covid is irrelevant, what matters is the lies and brainwash from the media and health authorities) has been a life-saving medicine for decades and won the Medicine Nobel prize in 2015. Another big lie is the 95% efficacy portrayed as absolute (as it should for any other vaccine approval) but both Pfizer and Moderna reported relative % efficacy and pretended it was absolute, the bigger the lie the more people will believe it, right? The real efficacy is below 1% which explains why in reality the vaccines didn't make a difference, or one can also argue that they made things worse by getting in the way of natural immunity against a weakening virus
"How the 95% mRNA vaccine efficacy was mostly fabricated but nobody looked"
#575156
https://m.stacker.news/45620
That is some shady math
But this clown discovered a great money making scheme, based on 'science', top propaganda, the desire of virtue signaling of the little man and stupidity. All respect to this man!
He's a war criminal
You may not be a fan, but the alternative was to believe the guy who said it would "magically go away" in a few weeks...
And he was right. It might have taken a bit longer than he predicted but that's basically what happened as the virus mutated and became weaker. Only the sheep who got vaxxed and boosted seem to get in now.
Mutations aren't the main reason. Pretty much the entire population has been infected, making the virus less dangerous because we all have some degree of immunity. Unfortunately there is evidence that people who got vaccinated have less immunity than unvaccinated, due to immune system imprinting on the wrong strains. But even then they're still less susceptible than a naive person getting infected for the first time.
This is true of most highly contagious illnesses: you get infected first as a kid, when you're relatively resistant to disease, and those antibodies keep you reasonable healthy for the rest of your life. Even in old age, when otherwise illnesses could do you a lot more harm. In some cases we have effective vaccines, and can shortcut the process by ensuring kids are unharmed by their first infection.
I've been infected for sure at least once (tested covid+), and was probably infected again recently (exposed to confirmed covid+). The first time was a flu with a moderate fever and an awful headache. The second time barely even qualified as a cold.
A vaccine that makes you less immune? So in other words, an anti-vax. Oh the irony.
The first time I had it I had the worst headache and fever.
But I didnt take the vaccine, so it should hit me hard.
After that, I was fine.
I dont think I have gotten it since!
I would have been fine with the alternative as would millions of other people in my country
What a pixie!!
And he was the one who pushed it so much.
I wonder how many he got?