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1000 sats \ 1 reply \ @orthzar 10 Aug 2023 \ parent \ on: Where will nostr be in 3 years nostr
This doesn't make any sense at all. My essay looks back 53 years to the original social media. You can't get any less short-sighted than that.
First of all, Nostr does not require payment in order to post. There are tons of relays that will let anyone post for free.
But even if every Nostr relay were to become pay-to-post, that would not eliminate spam on Nostr relays. Most spammers make money as a result of posting (e.g. ransomware, product promotions, etc). In order to disincentivize them from posting, you would have to raise the price-to-post higher than the return they get from posting.
That price is not going to be low, because a single person seeing the post could get the spammer a considerable amount of return. For instance, a post with a ransomware link could return hundreds of dollars for a single ransomware installation. But it would be insane for a relay to charge hundreds of dollars per post. Product promotions return far less, but even if they get $5 per post, charging that much per post would be unacceptable!
Arrogant people do that, yes. But people who have humility and a sense of shame do not do that IRL.
People drop their humility/shame when they post on social media. In effect, they become arrogant, but only while on social media, which is the opposite of social behavior.
The filtering that people apply to their words, as you mention in your third paragraph, is critical to social behavior. Most humans have thin skins, whether because of ignorance or arrogance (but I repeat myself). For their benefit, people filter their words; the ignorant and arrogant need help, not harassment.
Did you read the entirety of my essay? At the end of it, I directly stated that Nostr's current problem is that the hyper-focus on social media is preventing developers from making far more useful Nostr applications. It doesn't matter what users do; the application is the medium. And Nostr is currently a vehicle only for social media. And that is a tragedy.
(ps: I'm not angry at you at all in this post. This sort of back-and-forth is useful, because of the nature of the topic.)
short sighted
This doesn't make any sense at all. My essay looks back 53 years to the original social media. You can't get any less short-sighted than that.
Short sighted in the future looking sense not the backwards looking sense. It's also biased by your experiences with or assessment of usenet. It's a different beast and will not suffer the same fate. In other words, it's short signted because in the article your ascribe failures of usenet to nostr that nostr does not and will not suffer from, and was explicitly designed to combat.
First of all, Nostr does not require payment in order to post. There are tons of relays that will let anyone post for free.
Yes, for now. The end game is to combat bots and censorship with payed relays, once nostr gets big enough. Post all you want, but unless it's worth the cost of propagating it will not get far. Ask the devs or look up the early discussions about nostr. It's why lightning is even integrated with nostr and stacker news in the first place.
The theories behind these integrations goes back a long time.
Again, in the early days of email it was decided not to have payments attached with each sending for various infrastructure limitations at the time. There was a precedent and anticipation of spam and malware, crazy flyer campaigns, this is where the term "junk mail" came from, postal bomb terrorism of course.
With nostr early days, these limitations do not exist. If and when spam gets out of control and starts costing the network, implementing V4V will be much simpler, and users will have a ready way to pay. There will still be "free" onbording relays and community driven idological relays, the way disroot or riseup are community driven, but they themselves will have to limit abuse by exlclusion or KYC.
But even if every Nostr relay were to become pay-to-post, that would not eliminate spam on Nostr relays..... In order to dis-incentivize them from posting, you would have to raise the price-to-post higher than the return they get from posting.
Not necessarily. Paying for curated relays means you are paying someone to eliminate that spam for you. We do this now with gmail and others using our private data and identity profiles sold to advertisers. Nostr enables direct, liberty respecting filtration. This is all in the early discussions about nostr.
People drop their humility/shame when they post on social media. In effect, they become arrogant, but only while on social media, which is the opposite of social behavior. The filtering that people apply to their words, as you mention in your third paragraph, is critical to social behavior.
Then the word is incorrect. The words "social media" or web 2.0 postdates USENET. It is an attack word , a word loaded with venture capital and exploitation. It came along with Facebook and twitter and was not used before , specifically in the age of USENET.
The internet and text communication is neutral. You read the words, you interpret the context and implications. It is all happening in your head. It may have real or unreal consequences, fake or real intentions.
A huge mistake, one that is going to severely and irreparably damage civilization is what you are doing. Mistaking the two. You are mistaking the forest for the trees. Real social interactions with digital text. A huge part of this is the softness of modern life, we face few natural or existential threats, so minor inconveniences are felt disproportionately. Example: If your only or majority interaction with others is online and with your real identity where everyone is polite, say facebook, a context switch to an anonymous forum where no one holds back, would be traumatizing. One is a guarded truth, insincere, the other might be real but harsh. Again, in the full breadth of human culture and experience, both are valid. Americans are more intense then British people. what you are implying is American flamers and trolls are somehow doomed by virtue of their not being more like the subtle and polite British, as an example.
For their benefit, people filter their words; the ignorant and arrogant need help, not harassment.
This is an opinion and out-of-scope to this conversation and the point of your article, which is about the future of nostr and the history of online communication. What is considered " arrogant" is subjective and cultural. One cultures arrogance that needs to be cured, is another normal conversation.
It doesn't matter what users do; the application is the medium. And Nostr is currently a vehicle only for social media.
again, you are not looking in the right places, this is what is meant by adjusting you filter. Pablo7z is building all sorts of non-social stuff. There are market places being built. Games. DAO platforms. there are people working on tons of other innovations. I'm even working on a NIP that is non-social-media(i hate the word)
(ps: I'm not angry at you at all in this post. This sort of back-and-forth is useful, because of the nature of the topic.)
don't worry i have a thick skin and wouldn't care even if you were. What matters is the ideas. Even if you were to type in all-caps and use exclamation marks i would mostly read it ironically.
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