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DISCUSS: Why is it so hard to design an open-source smartphone?
1423 sats \ 10 comments \ @deSign_r 14h Design
Following SNL #194 conversation around open source phones OS 1, it seems that every project regarding open source smartphones OS are centered around the software only. Why not starting from the hardware instead of tweaking an existing OS?
Special mentions go to Waydroid, a container-based approach to boot a full Android system on regular GNU/Linux OS and Mecha Comet that together could revolutionize the industry currently dominated by tech giants.
How about Ubuntu Touch? It has been around for a while now, it's stable but still missing some features. And have you read about the Free Software Foundation announcing Librephone project? 2
There are plenty of open source mobile phone hardware products3 and no less FOSS mobile OS4, the most known, Lineage and GrapheneOS5, have proven that reverse engineering is hard. So I'm wondering why can't we have a project that starts from scratch and build the electronics and the OS? In the same spirit of what Apple did with iPhone+iOS. I'm sorry if I sound naive, I just don't realize how hard it is to design a smartphone.

Footnotes

  1. Live from TabConf 7 | SNL #194 #1257390 ↩
  2. BOSTON, Massachusetts, USA (Tuesday, October 14, 2025) — The Free Software Foundation (FSF) today announced its project to bring mobile phone freedom to users. "Librephone" is an initiative to reverse-engineer obstacles preventing mobile phone freedom until its goal is achieved. https://www.fsf.org/news/librephone-project ↩
  3. List of open-source mobile phones https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_open-source_mobile_phones ↩
  4. Open Source Mobile OS Alternatives To Android https://itsfoss.com/open-source-alternatives-android/ ↩
  5. GrapheneOS is finally ready to break free from Pixels #1255634 ↩
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319 sats \ 4 replies \ @optimism 9h
The FSF article (2) explains a bit why it is hard: firmware for many components are closed, also if you go through the open-BOM phones that are generously listed on Wikipedia under (3). Unless these are replaceable components 1 you're still manufacturer/model locked, and what I understood from a friend that has a fairphone, you're also kind of vendor locked; you order replacement components through fairphone.
So a lot of the stuff calling itself open source now is what Stallman would probably go nuts over in a talk as there's a lot of open-source washing going on. Librephone ought to be different, so that's something to keep an eye on. But they've just started building an inventory of everything closed that needs to be replaced, it's in prelim phase.

Footnotes

  1. for example, can you just swap out a Fairphone 6's Qualcomm SM7635 SoC for something else from another vendor? I'm skeptical but would love to be proven wrong. ↩
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100 sats \ 3 replies \ @justin_shocknet 3h
This, who's going to invest the substantial sum required to manufacturing opensource chips at economical scale?
National security states won't make it easy even if there were groups with enough resources to do it... a lot of people will fall out of windows or at least find themselves indicted over a parking ticket if they try undermining the ability to track everyone everywhere all the time.
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67 sats \ 1 reply \ @optimism 2h
Some of the rockchip SoCs are open source. I've tested a couple including compiling the firmware, and it's not too bad.
But I frankly have no idea how to test it for backdoors. Could be a honeypot.
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100 sats \ 0 replies \ @justin_shocknet 2h
There is a rockchip phone https://pine64.org/devices/pinephone_pro/
If anyone can do it'd be a state-industry like China trying to soften the market while giving themselves options outside of US/CIAwan chips, but yea I'm sure there are plenty of asterisks... and opensource design is only one part in the manufacturing the physical thing
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17 sats \ 0 replies \ @halalmoney 3h
Idealists: open source all the things
NSA enters the chat
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67 sats \ 0 replies \ @Scoresby 9h
I remember in the 90s in the US, buying organic products (pesticide, herbicide free) was expensive. Often it was difficult to find. Now organic products are widespread1 and often the price is only slightly elevated from normal.
It seems that open source phones are like organic products in the '90s. There really is very small demand for them. The popular culture around devices and software is so far from caring about open source devices that most people you speak to don't even know what you mean, much less have an understanding of why it is important.
Until more people demand it, I don't see a viable path. Perhaps we could learn from the granola crunchers.

Footnotes

  1. I'm sure there is a whole debate about how organic the organic products are, but let's operate under the assumption that they are at least a little organic. ↩
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21 sats \ 0 replies \ @anon 10h
My understanding is that a phone would be too expensive because it will be produced in less quantities compared to big brands. So it is not going to be competitive. E.g. not many people would buy such a phone for 2000-3000 EUR.
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150 sats \ 1 reply \ @kilianbuhn 13h
customers want a few very specific apps. They want Whatsapp and Instagram etc. And if your project doesn't have them, your project is doomed.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @deSign_r OP 11h
true, this apps are available in such systems, not as easily as it would be to type it in the playstore. Few extra steps are required depending on the phone hardware and OS, but they are definitely available.
It still early for zap.store, Such common apps are also available for download (anonymously) from stores like Aurora #1257869 are available.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Sandman 9h
Same devices with little upgrades every year. It's becoming boring 😞
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