No route for for territory payment \ stacker news ~lightning

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331 sats \ 24 comments \ @anna 20 Nov lightning

I have less than an hour to get a territory yearly paid for before I lose my 100k for the first month. I have the sats sitting in my alby wallet and I am told there is no route. What can I do? Is there a way to pay on chain or anything. @ek @k00b please help. I don’t want to lose the 100k I put in already.

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168 sats \ 2 replies \ @SimpleStacker 21h

Do you have a direct channel to Stacker.News lightning node?

I wrote a beginner guide here: #723978

11 sats \ 1 reply \ @anna OP 2h

Yes. I have one channel open with stacker news for over 900k and yet it is Telling me I don’t have enough.

1 sat \ 0 replies \ @ek 52m

Sorry for these lightning details, but how much you can spend over a channel depends on outbound liquidity (how much is on your side of the channel). Maybe that wasn't enough?

edit: Oh, I see your other comment. Will respond there.

26 sats \ 6 replies \ @DarthCoin 20 Nov

SN: we want everybody to use self-custodial wallets Reality: "i can't find route to pay the SN invoice..." SN stackers: Darthcoin you are a fool with your crazy ideas... #523570 Darth: yes, maybe I am crazy, but I know what am I talking about. Stackers are not ready yet for this move. They barely know how to open a LN wallet and SN already want everybody to run properly LN nodes. hahahahaha

190 sats \ 5 replies \ @Aardvark 20 Nov

Dude, I'm a complete idiot, so from that perspective, opening a lighting node seems pretty daunting.

I'm working on learing all of this stuff, because I actually find it very interesting and important to do, but it's definitely going to be a while before I have a node up and running.

20 sats \ 2 replies \ @nikotsla 23h

It's a long way, maybe you need this #694593 to start.

38 sats \ 1 reply \ @Aardvark 23h

I have coinos hooked up to SN already. I'd like to eventually start running a full lightning node though.

33 sats \ 0 replies \ @nikotsla 23h

Nice, this is an excellent path https://darthcoin.substack.com/p/stacking-sats-noob-journey to follow.

21 sats \ 1 reply \ @DarthCoin 23h

Learning is a long curve. I am not saying that you should not do it or you will never be able to run properly a LN node. What am I trying to say is that for running properly a LN node, require time, patience, a lot of reading and testing and... some capital and hardware.

It took me 3 years, almost 4 (2018-2022) to really understand how all the mechanisms and tools for LN are working, testing all days all available solutions. btw... Saylor was barely discovering Bitcoin when i was already testing LN nodes...

And that's why I wrote all those guides, based on my experiments and learning so you and other noobs will read them and not have to take 3-4 years, but maybe 4-5 months until you will reach that level when you could say "ok I know what am I doing with this LN node, I know how to manage it."

227 sats \ 0 replies \ @Aardvark 23h

Thanks for putting in the work. I appreciate SN providing seemingly endless resources for learning.

I'm stubborn and patient. Half a year of work to accomplish something doesn't even move the needle for me. I've put in far more time for way less.

50 sats \ 2 replies \ @siggy47 21h

Now do we all have to tell @DarthCoin that he was right again? I'm tired of this.

44 sats \ 1 reply \ @k00b 19h

When we have cowboy credits this specifically will be less of an issue because we can store an infinity of those on a stacker's behalf.

DC is right that bitcoin is hard to use trustlessly. It just won't get easier if none of us are willing to deal with how hard it is.

170 sats \ 0 replies \ @siggy47 19h

JFK: We are going to the moon not because it is easy, but because it is hard. Of course, many stackers don't believe in the moon landing 😀

11 sats \ 2 replies \ @anna OP 2h

I have a lightning channel set up between my node and stacker news lightning node. with 910k sats outbound available and 0 sats for inbound. When I go to pay the invoice for 900k it tells me I don’t have enough balance. What am I missing?

20 sats \ 1 reply \ @ek 47m

Mhh, not sure why it would count the channel reserve to outbound liquidity but 1% of a channel is usually not available to spend, so this might still be the issue you're running into:

What is a channel reserve?

A channel reserve is an amount that is set aside by each channel participant which ensures neither have ‘nothing at stake’ if a cheating attempt occurs. This reserve can not be spent, and is held aside for the entirety of the channels lifetime.

Channel reserves make cheating attempts less economical. When one channel party attempts to cheat the other and they are caught, a penalty transaction can be used to steal all the cheating parties bitcoin as punishment. Channel reserves makes it so cheating attempts always have something at stake making this less likely to occur.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @DarthCoin 27m

Add to that the channel buffer reserve... https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lnd/blob/6dea86428d031171af30119e3f6599820dc5454a/lnwallet/channel.go#L3803-L3815

1 sat \ 0 replies \ @anna OP 1h

It’s paid now :) Accomplished it by putting the payment on-chain and making a lightning payment

Thanks all for the suggestions and especially to @DesertDave who did lots of troubleshooting and experimenting with the lightning node

1 sat \ 3 replies \ @k00b 20 Nov

You won't lose your territory when it lapses. The territory just archives and you can pay it once you have a route again.

If you don't want to wait for block confirmations and you have bitcoin onchain, you can send it to an exchange that has lightning and pay that way.

11 sats \ 2 replies \ @anna OP 20 Nov

I am not worried about the territory. I want to pay for a year and not lose the initial 100k

1 sat \ 1 reply \ @k00b 23h

Oh I see. You actually won't lose your month. If you paid for a year now (900k), it'd extend your month by adding 11 months. If you wait until after the month to pay (1m), it'll give you 12 months.

If it makes a difference to you anyway and you can't get your lightning channels sorted in time, once you pay for the year we can refund you the 100k and adjust your billing cycle.

144 sats \ 0 replies \ @anna OP 23h

Ok I understand. Thanks! I’ll be working on it and see how it goes

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @Msd0457890 22h

But forgive my ignorance because if you have it in a wallet Alvin won't let you move it. I'm new to bitcoin but I didn't know that the wallet didn't let you move the funds? Or is it from a node?

0 sats \ 1 reply \ @ek 20 Nov

Hello, sorry for the trouble, we don’t do onchain for territory payments yet.

You can try to do an atomic swap from onchain to lightning via a service like Boltz.

111 sats \ 0 replies \ @DesertDave 1h

I tried this and the site says the the invoice expiration is too short. This very frustrating.