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SN release: *another* set of tip enhancements

752 sats \ 21 comments \ @k00b 13 Dec 2021 meta

Details

I just deployed a few more refinements to tipping.

No more half filled bolt.
- It felt extra when we have colors indicating tipping.
- The hack required to make the bolt look half filled would cause some weird artifacts in certain contexts.
Everyone's tip default is now 1 sat (no more popup on second click of bolt) and the tip default can only be set to another amount in settings. This is kind of a complex thing so it felt best to hide it for only advanced users to find.
Walkthrough for tipping.
- On your first upvote, a popover tells you you can press the bolt again to tip.
- On your first tip, a popover tells you you can press and hold the bolt to tip a custom amount.
I reset the log base of the color index into the rainbow gradient to 10,000 ... many users suggested 100,000 sats is likely too rare.

This will be the last tipping enhancement for awhile. I don't want to tweak it to death and I'm hungry for bigger features.

Things I think I'll be adding next:

wallet history: invoices, withdrawals, spending, and receiving
top for comments and users
search
bug fixes, game theory and design tweaks

If there's something else you'd like me to prioritize, speak up please even if you've already requested it before. I try to prioritize user requests and sometimes I have to hear a request a couple times to believe you actually want it.

Pre-seed fundraising update

SN has found a lead investor and has verbal and full commitments for the entire $300k we are raising. Details will follow when the money clears which thanks to legacy banking is slow af.

view all related items

102 sats \ 1 reply \ @jack 13 Dec 2021

Found a little bug -- long-clicked on the bolt and added 500 sats. (did not short click, just long clicked) The bolt is not lit up at all on this post view page or the home page. Just clicked on it again and it's blue now.

And congrats on getting funding!!!!! Can't wait to see what's in store.

1 sat \ 0 replies \ @k00b OP 13 Dec 2021

Ah! I see. You were able to tip without upvoting. Thanks for reporting!

3 sats \ 5 replies \ @cameri 17 Dec 2021

hovering over the posted date shows the full time in ISO8601 UTC
the date should be the permalink instead of n replies
ability to give awards like in reddit

1 sat \ 4 replies \ @k00b OP 17 Dec 2021

The date is a permalink if you click on it. Are you talking about something else?

Awards would be cool. I’m hoping to have badges and stuff in the future, e.g. first 1000 active users get an OG badge.

1 sat \ 1 reply \ @cameri 6 Jan 2022

I was thinking that awards could be just tags and look like pills with text in them.

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @k00b OP 6 Jan 2022

That'd be much cleaner. I tend to think reddit overdoes the icons.

1 sat \ 1 reply \ @cameri 17 Dec 2021

The date on the original post is a permalink but it's not for comments. The permalink for comments is on n replies and the date is just a <span>

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @k00b OP 18 Dec 2021

Ah good catch!

4 sats \ 1 reply \ @kr 14 Dec 2021

would love to see a lightning-native job board where companies can pay to have their job listings ranked above each other.

it would bring in meaningful revenue for stacker news and give users a much better experience than linking out to the bitcoiner jobs site.

1 sat \ 0 replies \ @k00b OP 14 Dec 2021

Current plans are to add the board after search. Hopefully it'll be my first release of the new year.

3 sats \ 0 replies \ @relc 13 Dec 2021

i like doubletips

2 sats \ 0 replies \ @alvaraaltopelti 14 Dec 2021

Add sending to lightning address?

2 sats \ 4 replies \ @abetusk 14 Dec 2021

A recent post on HN reminds me that Quora and HN both have really bad licenses for their content and comments. I've created an issue for it but I would urge you again to consider putting a libre/free license on the content on this site.

Quora and HN are both a tragedy waiting to happen when their popularity wanes. As far as I know, Experts Exchange is pretty much faded to irrelevancy and its content is effectively lost. It would be nice to try to guard against it by providing the content on this site to the community.

HN is especially tragic. Imagine the future entrepreneurs and innovators able to bootstrap from such a rich dataset. They talk about disruption and even seem to be pretty pro FOSS but when it comes to their own data, they gate keep like the rest of them.

Which reminds me of making the API easier to use (perhaps just documenting it more?) and/or providing an easily downloadable dataset to grab.

Congrats on the investor situation!

2 sats \ 3 replies \ @k00b OP 14 Dec 2021

My one concern with the content licensing is what happens when we eventually do something like https://yalls.org/ ... I guess by default all content on the site is covered by CC BY-SA 4.0. Then perhaps in the "options" accordion when creating a post a user can specify a more strict license? Any thoughts on that?

In regards to the API, I suspect it should just be read-only presenting feeds and allow for drilling down into posts and comments.

1 sat \ 2 replies \ @abetusk 14 Dec 2021

I would advise against keeping content locked under a proprietary license.

There's a few reasons to provide a libre/free license (like CC-BY-SA):

It helps guard against future irrelevancy by making the data easy to replicate
It provides a potentially rich dataset for programmers, entrepreneurs etc.
In general, it gives back to the community and is much in the spirit of what Bitcoin is about, libre/free source that allows for re-use and modification, even for commercial reuse

Were you to not put the content under a libre/free license, you're heavily favoring you or your organization as gatekeeper to the knowledge. In this case, SN would most likely be effectively be the sole licensee of the data which means everyone in this community is now not only giving you sats to participate but also handing you effectively sole use of their intellectual property.

It looks like you have a potential business model in mind in terms of "paying for articles" (like Y'alls?). From my perspective, the fundamental question is what's actually gained by providing content that isn't libre/free for the community to use.

Your concern is that someone won't pay if the content is under a libre/free license? Under what scenario would you be using the intellectual property angle to enforce copyright violations? Notice on HN that the first post to paywalled articles is a link to a non-paywalled archive site so people can read the articles.

My view is that convenience supersedes a lot of these concerns. People don't care about spending a couple sats, especially considering we're doing it anyway by tipping or upvoting, so providing easy avenues to pay for articles is the main issue, not whether we can view the article by paying the absolute minimum for it.

In terms of providing options for individuals to change the license of their content, I would also advise against it. It's confusing and any re-use of the dataset now becomes problematic to use. At best, users direct content needs to be filtered. At worst, anyone using the dataset now has to do a similarity test for all the content against the proprietary portions to make sure they're not in violation of the users license choice.

My view is it's reasonable to ask participants to put their content under a CC-BY-SA license. The content is on the internet, it's pretty much available anyway. Instead of shying away from it, lean into it and provide it under a libre/free license. The price to participate in the community is that you're adding the commons by doing so. The license is just being explicit about it.

On a personal note, one of the reasons why I'm excited about this community is because it has the possibility to embody portions of the ideology behind Bitcoin I find compelling. I know if there were a system that funneled the intellectual property to SN for essentially exclusive use, I would be less interested in participating and championing it.

In terms of the API, the first step is to make the data available to people to read. I imagine the primary use case is to query or download the dataset for some use. Providing an easy facility to do that, maybe by providing better documentation, examples, etc. is the primary concern.

If people want programmatic access to their accounts through the API, that's cool, but not a feature you need right now?

1 sat \ 1 reply \ @k00b OP 14 Dec 2021

Your concern is that someone won't pay if the content is under a libre/free license? Under what scenario would you be using the intellectual property angle to enforce copyright violations? Notice on HN that the first post to paywalled articles is a link to a non-paywalled archive site so people can read the articles.

No, my concern is users won't post certain kinds of content, particularly valuable original content, if in doing so they permit anyone else to use it however they'd like.

4 sats \ 0 replies \ @abetusk 14 Dec 2021

Alright, well, regardless, the IP will still be licensed by SN and SN will be positioned to be the gatekeeper to that knowledge.

I think this is standard startup playbook stuff, whereby a platform is created, a moat is built around all the content and everyone is funneled into a walled silo of content.

When I look at Twitter, Facebook and the rest of social media, the only ray of hope is cryptocurrency and some decentralized content, where incentives are given by the currency and decentralization is bolstered by the libre/free license.

In my opinion, sites that don't actively try to make their content accessible are doomed to have their content disappear. I don't know if Experts Exchange has their knowledge base available in any meaningful way but they've faded to irrelevancy. AOL has long since faded. My belief is that it's only a matter of time before Twitter, FB, Quora and even HN have their data lost. They're never incentivized to make the data available to the community and if they ever do, because they're failing, it's often too late as they're already passed the threshold of irrelevancy.

StackOverflow, Wikipedia etc. have embraced the libre/free idea and, in my opinion, are better for it. When I think of sites like this, I envision some hybrid of SO and Wikipedia where the digital currency allows for direct monetary rewards to contributors.

1 sat \ 1 reply \ @cameri 27 Dec 2021

I'm an idiot and I lose whatever I was typing all the time, either I mess up or my cat walks over my keyboard and navigates away... perhaps we could have drafts saved to local storage?

0 sats \ 0 replies \ @k00b OP 27 Dec 2021

Yep good call!

1 sat \ 0 replies \ @ThrillerX_ 16 Dec 2021

Search would be huge✊🏼

1 sat \ 0 replies \ @falsefaucet 14 Dec 2021

i cant be the only one who mashed the shit out of the tip thing to see the colors change