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Long-form Content: ecash (Transacting with ecash while offline) by gandlaf21njump.me/naddr1qq25cjpsdfeyj3z9f3txsejnfezk6mjpwagyyq3qcj6ndx5akfazux7f0vjl4fyx9k0ulf682p437fe03a9ndwqjm0tqxpqqqp65w5zjwnt
206 sats \ 15 comments \ @m0wer 15h bitcoin
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100 sats \ 1 reply \ @ek 15h
But, if you don't have proofs that match the amount, you would need to go online and swap for the needed proofs at the mint.
This also applies to offline receives.
The sender needs to not only know the recipient in advance, but also what denominations they will use. The recipient can’t give you change back.
Still useful, but that’s another important limitation.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @m0wer OP 58m
For the case of vending machines that's fine. The problem to solve is that the machine can operate without internet, not the customer. So as a customer you can easily get the exact denomination and sign it for the machine online and then the machine does not need internet to verify it.
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0 sats \ 4 replies \ @BlokchainB 10h
If I create a nut and then send it offline can’t I reclaim it first before the receiver?
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95 sats \ 3 replies \ @m0wer OP 1h
If I create a nut and then send it offline can’t I reclaim it first before the receiver?
Yes, you can reclaim a nut before the receiver in basic offline transactions - that's the double-spending problem.
However, if the sender creates a token locked to your public key (for untrusted transactions), then no, they cannot reclaim it because only you can redeem it with your private key.
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23 sats \ 0 replies \ @BlokchainB 53m
Ah thanks for the explanation
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0 sats \ 1 reply \ @SwapMarket 47m
This is subject to sender's mint not cheating. I can run a mint that will issue nuts not backed by anything. So I have no problem locking them to the receiver. The whole idea is based on a delusion. Cashus don't work trustlessly. And trust is not Bitcoin's philosophy.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @m0wer OP 44m
Cashus don't work trustlessly.
Of course not. The question is if it's the best way of solving the problem of offline payments. The other option currently is banknotes which as you know have other inconveniences.
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0 sats \ 6 replies \ @SwapMarket 11h
  1. Offline wending machines are possible with Lightning, if the payer has internet access.
  2. "It cannot contain duplicate proofs (double-spend)" How can an offline receiver verify this? A customized mint can issue Cashu coins not backed by anythig. Cashu are scam.
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0 sats \ 5 replies \ @m0wer OP 59m
Sure you have to trust the mint. But you can set a collection of trusted mints beforehand.
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0 sats \ 4 replies \ @SwapMarket 52m
I can't, because I don't normally know in advance what mint the payer will use. And I don't want to trust anyone!
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0 sats \ 3 replies \ @m0wer OP 40m
There is no way to solve the trust issue offline. Bitcoin solves that hard problem by creating a decentralized trustless ledger. Offline you don't have that possibility.
You should avoid using Cashu in general, because there are better options. What's a better option for this case?
For a vending machine operator, the risk of double spends might be worth it compared to the cost of having an internet connection for the machine. It's all about tradeoffs.
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21 sats \ 1 reply \ @SwapMarket 37m
This: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5381769.0
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @m0wer OP 30m
Yes that's very nice.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @SwapMarket 33m
And no, I don't use cashu and fight everyone propagating this scammy idea. No one in their right mind should accept Cashu. It only works for the payers with own mints, they are driving the narrative.
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0 sats \ 0 replies \ @SwapMarket 30m
Stop spreading scammy ideas. Offline wending machine with Lightning has been long solved: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5381769.0
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